They Did “The Nash”

Nash_rend
The Nash (.pdf file) won unanimous approval from the Raleigh Planning Commission today. The 7-story condo building will rise at the NW corner of Hargett and Dawson Streets. Included in the plan are 208 condominium units, a somewhat hidden parking garage, courtyard with a pool, and Hargett street retail parcels. A representative from Trammell-Crowe, the developer, mentioned the company’s goal of selling these mostly 1-bedroom units somewhere near the $300,000 mark.

Nash001
Functionally the building works quite well. The market is demanding smaller units, and these condos will likely be smaller than other new alternatives; somewhere around the 800 square foot mark (Note: This is not confirmed, just my own estimate. The point is the building’s focus is on small units.). A downtown overall development map (which has disappeared from the downtown alliance site) showed Hargett and Martin as important East/West retail corridors linking the Eastern portion of downtown to the TTA train stop in the Warehouse District. The alignment of five or so retail outlets works well in space that normally wouldn’t sell easily as residential.

Nash002
Unfortunately the parking garage access is placed at the left end of this retail row. Perhaps integrating the service alley on the north side with the Dawson’s service ally would allow parking garage access from a lesser traveled sidewalk.

During the meeting Commissioner Betsy Kane addressed the redundant vehicular accesses that will be side-by-side on the Dawson Street margins of both properties. She pointed out that the service and parking garage access issue is so common with these new developments that the city should consider an ally system within the block to allow for common access and minimize pedestrian disturbance. Good idea! A shared access for the Dawson and The Nash’s service and parking areas would be an efficient use of space and offer an unbroken retail strip along Hargett.

Park_hotel
Nash Square is a special block in downtown Raleigh, and surrounding buildings should acknowledge the public square. The Victorian Park Hotel once sat over on Martin Street diagonally across the square from the site of The Nash. Even then architects knew that the feature corner of the building should address the formal park with its best feature. So kudos to the architects for getting this dramatic element right.

Nash010
While the building serves many great purposes, preliminary sketches appear to make it look cheap, though. The plain treatment of the windows, EIFS skin, and partial blue color scheme hold little promise for the public’s love of this building in the future. Perhaps a  style that hasn’t been used in downtown Raleigh like French, Gothic, or something else could make this building a classic for the ages for relatively the same cost. Given its prominent location, it is important that this building be one that adequately coexists with its neighbor, Nash Square.

Nash012
Planning Director Mitchel Silver showed several images of the project’s impact on the neighborhood skyline. At 7-stories this project adds mass, but not height like the nearby Reynolds tower "projected at 30 stories". Silver showed alternative massing for this project at 14 stories and showed how only half of the property would only have to be used. While 14-stories creates more of a landmark building, I’ll take the 7-stories at this point. Downtown Raleigh has nearly 150 unbuilt lots, so we’re not even close to having a land scarcity.

The project still must gain acceptance by the Raleigh City Council, however, because if its size, scope, and downtown location.

Nash003 Nash004 Nash005
Nash006 Nash013 Nash007

map it

  • Ron T

    It looks like the Seaboard area is going to keep going. And, with some apartments and more affordable condos!
    http://www.newsobserver.com/104/story/521258.html
    Let’s hope for a more interesting design! Either way, it’s more people downtown.

  • Ron T

    It looks like the Seaboard area is going to keep going. And, with some apartments and more affordable condos!
    http://www.newsobserver.com/104/story/521258.html
    Let’s hope for a more interesting design! Either way, it’s more people downtown.

  • lee

    Raleigh needs to focus on bringing in bigger businesses and company’s which is a major factor missing in downtown. For whatever reason, the Raleigh leaders are on this condo boom and I think it’s getting out of hand. It seems like they want to catch up with the condo needs in other citys. Hence the prices which are similar to city’s like Atlanta and Miami.
    I currently live in DT Raleigh, and to be honest, it’s boring. In the next couple of years, there’s going to be nothing but condo’s in downtown. So if your idea of fun is to sit on your condo’s balcony and stare at each other, have at it! Plus, I think parking shouldn’t be forgotten in the growth of DT Raleigh. Everyone whats DT to grow, with more shops, restaurants, etc, yet it seems that all of these new condos are taking over the parking lots. One example is the new West building. I am a current member at the Peak Fitness gym downtown. It’s going to suck once they start construction on the West because there’s no where else to park. And what does the city do to help this issue? Well, they come in and put in “no parking” signs along the road. gee thanks!
    Raleigh needs to expand its commercial stock. The two buildings (that are no taller than 16 stories) we currently have in our glamorous city skyline are not cutting it. Raleigh needs to first bring in the “work” in “work, live & play” that a city needs to exist. Then the other two will surely follow. Until that happens, DT Raleigh will remain just a town.

  • lee

    Raleigh needs to focus on bringing in bigger businesses and company’s which is a major factor missing in downtown. For whatever reason, the Raleigh leaders are on this condo boom and I think it’s getting out of hand. It seems like they want to catch up with the condo needs in other citys. Hence the prices which are similar to city’s like Atlanta and Miami.
    I currently live in DT Raleigh, and to be honest, it’s boring. In the next couple of years, there’s going to be nothing but condo’s in downtown. So if your idea of fun is to sit on your condo’s balcony and stare at each other, have at it! Plus, I think parking shouldn’t be forgotten in the growth of DT Raleigh. Everyone whats DT to grow, with more shops, restaurants, etc, yet it seems that all of these new condos are taking over the parking lots. One example is the new West building. I am a current member at the Peak Fitness gym downtown. It’s going to suck once they start construction on the West because there’s no where else to park. And what does the city do to help this issue? Well, they come in and put in “no parking” signs along the road. gee thanks!
    Raleigh needs to expand its commercial stock. The two buildings (that are no taller than 16 stories) we currently have in our glamorous city skyline are not cutting it. Raleigh needs to first bring in the “work” in “work, live & play” that a city needs to exist. Then the other two will surely follow. Until that happens, DT Raleigh will remain just a town.

  • Betsy

    There are currently 42,000 parking spaces in downtown, but if that’s not enough for you, perhaps you should consider walking from your downtown residence to your downtown gym.

  • Betsy

    There are currently 42,000 parking spaces in downtown, but if that’s not enough for you, perhaps you should consider walking from your downtown residence to your downtown gym.

  • Dana

    It’s great to hear from someone who lives downtown. Did you mean 29 stories? (that’s what the Wachovia and BB&T; buildings are).
    I’m going to trust that the developers and their financial trustees have done more market research than I, and assume that they know how to properly delineate Raleigh’s demands from other cities. It really does seem like a lot of supply coming on line within a 3 year period.
    It was only recently that the phrase “Live,Work,Play” sprouted for developments, but the combo has long been a staple for development. For decades the thrust of Downtown Raleigh revitalization was on Work with a little play. The thinking was that as long as people are working downtown, they’ll want to live near downtown.
    Well that idea really didn’t go far. Interestingly leaders and developers decided to make the tail wag the dog in this case. By bringing people in to live in an urban environment, we’ll get more “Work” downtown. This won’t happen overnight, but is certain to be the next wave in downtown development.
    Isn’t it ironic that people going to workout don’t want to park far away?

  • Dana

    It’s great to hear from someone who lives downtown. Did you mean 29 stories? (that’s what the Wachovia and BB&T buildings are).
    I’m going to trust that the developers and their financial trustees have done more market research than I, and assume that they know how to properly delineate Raleigh’s demands from other cities. It really does seem like a lot of supply coming on line within a 3 year period.
    It was only recently that the phrase “Live,Work,Play” sprouted for developments, but the combo has long been a staple for development. For decades the thrust of Downtown Raleigh revitalization was on Work with a little play. The thinking was that as long as people are working downtown, they’ll want to live near downtown.
    Well that idea really didn’t go far. Interestingly leaders and developers decided to make the tail wag the dog in this case. By bringing people in to live in an urban environment, we’ll get more “Work” downtown. This won’t happen overnight, but is certain to be the next wave in downtown development.
    Isn’t it ironic that people going to workout don’t want to park far away?

  • 150

    I live downtown, also, and I disagree with the boring aspect. I think things are coming along nicely.
    Betsy, I agree with you about parking. There’s plenty. One of the great aspects of living in downtown Raleigh is that you can walk everywhere, and safely too, as the vehicle traffic isn’t bad. Heck, I get my exercise by jogging downtown, instead of driving a few blocks to a gym.
    Dana, I like your point about the research that the developers have done. I live in one of the very few townhouse communities downtown and I am skeptical about the demand for all of these condos, too (add Bloomsbury to the mix, it’s going up). Whenever I walk by the Dawson or the Park Deveraux, there seem to be an awful lot of dark units. Still, the developers are the experts and they are the ones plunking down the money to build, so I have to have faith that the demand is there.
    I still would like to see more townhouses or actual apartments instead of more condos, but at this point, I’m really happy for anything going in.

  • 150

    I live downtown, also, and I disagree with the boring aspect. I think things are coming along nicely.
    Betsy, I agree with you about parking. There’s plenty. One of the great aspects of living in downtown Raleigh is that you can walk everywhere, and safely too, as the vehicle traffic isn’t bad. Heck, I get my exercise by jogging downtown, instead of driving a few blocks to a gym.
    Dana, I like your point about the research that the developers have done. I live in one of the very few townhouse communities downtown and I am skeptical about the demand for all of these condos, too (add Bloomsbury to the mix, it’s going up). Whenever I walk by the Dawson or the Park Deveraux, there seem to be an awful lot of dark units. Still, the developers are the experts and they are the ones plunking down the money to build, so I have to have faith that the demand is there.
    I still would like to see more townhouses or actual apartments instead of more condos, but at this point, I’m really happy for anything going in.

  • lee

    well then, your 42,000 parking spaces are not in a functional area. and there are some days that walking to the gym is not such a great idea.
    and about the boring aspect, to each their own then. i live in park deveraux and it is aweful shading over in that section. everyday a homeless person will walk by asking for money. It doesn’t exactly give me a safe feeling, especially with that woman being kidnapped from the Progress Energy parking deck.

  • lee

    well then, your 42,000 parking spaces are not in a functional area. and there are some days that walking to the gym is not such a great idea.
    and about the boring aspect, to each their own then. i live in park deveraux and it is aweful shading over in that section. everyday a homeless person will walk by asking for money. It doesn’t exactly give me a safe feeling, especially with that woman being kidnapped from the Progress Energy parking deck.

  • 150

    Lee, I’m confused. You seem to be upset that “for whatever reason, the Raleigh leaders are on this condo boom”, dislike that the condos are taking over the parking spaces, and find Raleigh boring with your sitting on the condo’s balcony comments. Yet, you live in one. You also say it’s shady near there (I really disagree here and I live a few blocks from you).
    I ask these questions respectfully. Why did you choose to live in Park Deveraux? Why downtown for that matter?

  • 150

    Lee, I’m confused. You seem to be upset that “for whatever reason, the Raleigh leaders are on this condo boom”, dislike that the condos are taking over the parking spaces, and find Raleigh boring with your sitting on the condo’s balcony comments. Yet, you live in one. You also say it’s shady near there (I really disagree here and I live a few blocks from you).
    I ask these questions respectfully. Why did you choose to live in Park Deveraux? Why downtown for that matter?

  • lee

    Oh I’m not upset, more so confused in the future of Raleigh. I came back to Raleigh after living in Atlanta for a number of years. I moved to PD because it was “downtown,” it was city-life and close to everything. I cringe at the idea of living outside, away from a city in a cookie-cutter house. (I’m sorry if I offended anyone, but it’s just not my cup-o-tea). To me, “downtown” means its the city’s hub filled with attractions and culture. I really like Raleigh, it has a comfortable feel to it. But I see so much potential and I feel that all of these condos have been the focus in building up DT Raleigh. There is no way that all of these condos will sell anytime soon. There’s not exactly a huge demand for the area. When you break it down, the triangle is great for the 30 or 40 something yr olds with families. And those types of small families will look at the area and see that they can buy a 3,000 sq ft house on a acre of land for a very reasonable price. Hence the flocking to N. Raleigh, Cary, Apex. So why would these people pay $300k for a 800 sq ft condo? So, what I meant earlier, is if these condos are going to sell, they’re more than likely going to sell to the younger, hip crowd. But in order to attract that type of crowd, DT Raleigh needs big time, global companies located ITB. Bring in the PWC’s and the creative ad agencies, bring in the places young professionals would want to work, instead of the state goverment buildings.
    And I’m sorry but I have to disagree about the shady spots. That area is kind of strange, everyday I will find a couple homeless people walking around, yet, when I walk over to the Saucer, it seems like a different world just one block away. But everyday I’ll see randoms just standing in the corners of Harrington and Hargett. Especially on the days I do walk to the gym.

  • lee

    Oh I’m not upset, more so confused in the future of Raleigh. I came back to Raleigh after living in Atlanta for a number of years. I moved to PD because it was “downtown,” it was city-life and close to everything. I cringe at the idea of living outside, away from a city in a cookie-cutter house. (I’m sorry if I offended anyone, but it’s just not my cup-o-tea). To me, “downtown” means its the city’s hub filled with attractions and culture. I really like Raleigh, it has a comfortable feel to it. But I see so much potential and I feel that all of these condos have been the focus in building up DT Raleigh. There is no way that all of these condos will sell anytime soon. There’s not exactly a huge demand for the area. When you break it down, the triangle is great for the 30 or 40 something yr olds with families. And those types of small families will look at the area and see that they can buy a 3,000 sq ft house on a acre of land for a very reasonable price. Hence the flocking to N. Raleigh, Cary, Apex. So why would these people pay $300k for a 800 sq ft condo? So, what I meant earlier, is if these condos are going to sell, they’re more than likely going to sell to the younger, hip crowd. But in order to attract that type of crowd, DT Raleigh needs big time, global companies located ITB. Bring in the PWC’s and the creative ad agencies, bring in the places young professionals would want to work, instead of the state goverment buildings.
    And I’m sorry but I have to disagree about the shady spots. That area is kind of strange, everyday I will find a couple homeless people walking around, yet, when I walk over to the Saucer, it seems like a different world just one block away. But everyday I’ll see randoms just standing in the corners of Harrington and Hargett. Especially on the days I do walk to the gym.

  • Ron T

    The “condo boom” would be a problem if all fo the first floors did NOT have retail spaces. The fact that they do means that as more residents move in – there will be places to open the stores where they will shop.

  • Ron T

    The “condo boom” would be a problem if all fo the first floors did NOT have retail spaces. The fact that they do means that as more residents move in – there will be places to open the stores where they will shop.

  • 150

    Lee: Interesting. I see your point about the focus being too heavy on the condos, not heavy enough on the business. I agree that for the same amount of money, a lot of people will choose the house with a yard, especially if they have kids, over the condo. This is part of why I doubt that the demand is there for all of the new condo developments. Still, I have to just trust the experts.
    This is really the reason I think some apartments, not condos, should be built. More options for the people in their 20s and 30s, who have good jobs and would spend money on nightlife, but can’t quite afford those condos. Maybe that will come later.
    Last thing, Lee, I’m curious about how full Park Deveraux is. Does it seem like it’s full to you?

  • 150

    Lee: Interesting. I see your point about the focus being too heavy on the condos, not heavy enough on the business. I agree that for the same amount of money, a lot of people will choose the house with a yard, especially if they have kids, over the condo. This is part of why I doubt that the demand is there for all of the new condo developments. Still, I have to just trust the experts.
    This is really the reason I think some apartments, not condos, should be built. More options for the people in their 20s and 30s, who have good jobs and would spend money on nightlife, but can’t quite afford those condos. Maybe that will come later.
    Last thing, Lee, I’m curious about how full Park Deveraux is. Does it seem like it’s full to you?

  • lee

    I believe that there are only one or two for sale. And all but 3 are being lived in.

  • lee

    I believe that there are only one or two for sale. And all but 3 are being lived in.

  • ddf

    I see Lee’s point and I have to say that I somewhat agree. Not that having nice luxury condos downtown is bad, but having more big business would be even better. I own a place at the Dawson, and have had the chance to talk with David Reynolds about their plans for the skyscraper that will face my condo unit. They are in talks with a 500 company (name not disclosed) to anchor that tower. That is the sort of thing that we need. Once we get more big name companies in DT, there will be a huge demand for the high-end condos.
    Maybe that is what the city officials already know, which is why developers are in a rush to buy land, build, and increase the supply of condos—to meet the anticipated future demands?

  • ddf

    I see Lee’s point and I have to say that I somewhat agree. Not that having nice luxury condos downtown is bad, but having more big business would be even better. I own a place at the Dawson, and have had the chance to talk with David Reynolds about their plans for the skyscraper that will face my condo unit. They are in talks with a 500 company (name not disclosed) to anchor that tower. That is the sort of thing that we need. Once we get more big name companies in DT, there will be a huge demand for the high-end condos.
    Maybe that is what the city officials already know, which is why developers are in a rush to buy land, build, and increase the supply of condos—to meet the anticipated future demands?

  • ChiefJoJo

    I agree with Betsy about the parking issue. It’s rediculous. I walk everywhere from my condo (work, gym, etc) and leave the car at home. She’s right–there are 42k spaces, so they are out there!
    I actually like this project–the design is solid if not spectacular, and the street retail is present, which is critical to making DTR what it can be.
    As far as the condo demand, I bet that these guys know what they’re doing, or else the bank would put on the brakes. Something like 10k people move to Raleigh each year–some of them will buy condos. Then there’s the empty-nesters/baby-boom crowd, and the 20s/30s single crowd (like me) already here and looking to move to an urban lifesyle. Keep in mind the developer hasn’t made more info available so I doubt an 800 sf condo will go for $300k. FWIW, if TTA ever builds the transit system, I predict you will see the condo market go absolutely nuts in this area.

  • ChiefJoJo

    I agree with Betsy about the parking issue. It’s rediculous. I walk everywhere from my condo (work, gym, etc) and leave the car at home. She’s right–there are 42k spaces, so they are out there!
    I actually like this project–the design is solid if not spectacular, and the street retail is present, which is critical to making DTR what it can be.
    As far as the condo demand, I bet that these guys know what they’re doing, or else the bank would put on the brakes. Something like 10k people move to Raleigh each year–some of them will buy condos. Then there’s the empty-nesters/baby-boom crowd, and the 20s/30s single crowd (like me) already here and looking to move to an urban lifesyle. Keep in mind the developer hasn’t made more info available so I doubt an 800 sf condo will go for $300k. FWIW, if TTA ever builds the transit system, I predict you will see the condo market go absolutely nuts in this area.

  • S

    Just an fyi…there is currently 1 unit on the market at Park Devereux (it is up for rent/for lease), there are only a few units left at the Dawson, none available for rent, Bloomsbury Estates is something like 65% sold, 222 has seen some great sales numbers, West has as well, the Paramount has 3 units for sale and none for rent, 630 North street is at almost half reserved, RBC supposedly has all 130 reserved, and back up reservations on all of them, and even back ups on the back ups (so they say…)there is 1 unit for sale at 510 Glenwood, none for rent, I’m not sure how the Glen on Peace has been so far.
    But from the numbers it seems like the demand is in fact there. Yes, the Hudson is struggling, but on the whole, the condo market here is thriving.
    As far as apartments go…I have heard from the people at 712 Tucker that they are debating about whether or not to do all units to own, or some to own, some to rent. Go to their website and give them you’re input. This blog is great, but I doubt a ton of developers read it.
    And on the Peak Fitness parking note….there is a new lot diagonal to the West at North site. Just park there…

  • S

    Just an fyi…there is currently 1 unit on the market at Park Devereux (it is up for rent/for lease), there are only a few units left at the Dawson, none available for rent, Bloomsbury Estates is something like 65% sold, 222 has seen some great sales numbers, West has as well, the Paramount has 3 units for sale and none for rent, 630 North street is at almost half reserved, RBC supposedly has all 130 reserved, and back up reservations on all of them, and even back ups on the back ups (so they say…)there is 1 unit for sale at 510 Glenwood, none for rent, I’m not sure how the Glen on Peace has been so far.
    But from the numbers it seems like the demand is in fact there. Yes, the Hudson is struggling, but on the whole, the condo market here is thriving.
    As far as apartments go…I have heard from the people at 712 Tucker that they are debating about whether or not to do all units to own, or some to own, some to rent. Go to their website and give them you’re input. This blog is great, but I doubt a ton of developers read it.
    And on the Peak Fitness parking note….there is a new lot diagonal to the West at North site. Just park there…

  • Spike

    Is it true the Hudson has some units with no windows at all?

  • Spike

    Is it true the Hudson has some units with no windows at all?

  • http://jnkowens.com/ jnkowens

    “Is it true the Hudson has some units with no windows at all?”
    Not true. What is true is that none of the 2BR units have windows in the 2nd BR except for units 316, 416, and 516 – which happen to be the three most expensive units in the building.
    Also, some of the units have only a few linear feet of windows (the ones on the interior corners especially) for the whole apartment.
    I have personally toured every single unit type in the building and came away unimpressed. I think the concept was good (of renovating an existing structure) and the execution horrible.

  • http://jnkowens.com jnkowens

    “Is it true the Hudson has some units with no windows at all?”
    Not true. What is true is that none of the 2BR units have windows in the 2nd BR except for units 316, 416, and 516 – which happen to be the three most expensive units in the building.
    Also, some of the units have only a few linear feet of windows (the ones on the interior corners especially) for the whole apartment.
    I have personally toured every single unit type in the building and came away unimpressed. I think the concept was good (of renovating an existing structure) and the execution horrible.

  • lee

    what really kills it is that the Hudson only has one available parking spot underneath or each owner. So I guess only singles can live there. Unless you want to park in the Progress Energy building parking deck a block and a half away. (dont think so).

  • lee

    what really kills it is that the Hudson only has one available parking spot underneath or each owner. So I guess only singles can live there. Unless you want to park in the Progress Energy building parking deck a block and a half away. (dont think so).

  • Renfield

    I, for one, will miss the Bradshaw Realty building.

  • Renfield

    I, for one, will miss the Bradshaw Realty building.

  • lee

    lol, is that really considered a building? it was cute no less.

  • lee

    lol, is that really considered a building? it was cute no less.

  • ronb

    The Nash will hopefully add more retail space to the warehouse district, and will add hundreds of potential TTA rail riders. The “Dawson” line of condos ends at Park Dev, but hopefully that will continue south soon. And west, to connect to Bloomsbury, but there is a lot of “wait and see” for TTA’s plans.
    One of the Hudson’s problems is the elevator bank is on the south side… During this year’s downtown home tour, I noticed a walk to units on the north side is quite long, on uncarpetd, unforgiving concrete. The kitchens and bathrooms are “blank slates” for owners to finish the way they want, but the cost of the units do not reflect this.
    The neighborhood just east of downtown is “urban safe”, but not “suburban safe”. Houses go for a lot less, but do need a lot of work. It depends on what you want.
    I’m a Peak (R.I.P. CapFit) member, and a walk is about 20 minutes, a bike ride is 5-10, depending on how I catch the lights. I have only seen two or three other bikes locked up when I did; it is hard to tell if anyone walked there vs. walked from a car parked around the corner, so I don’t know that number.
    Glenwood South will soon need another public deck, in addition to 510 and Powerhouse Square. The Quorum building looks to have excess capacity, especially at night, but will people walk a few blocks?

  • ronb

    The Nash will hopefully add more retail space to the warehouse district, and will add hundreds of potential TTA rail riders. The “Dawson” line of condos ends at Park Dev, but hopefully that will continue south soon. And west, to connect to Bloomsbury, but there is a lot of “wait and see” for TTA’s plans.
    One of the Hudson’s problems is the elevator bank is on the south side… During this year’s downtown home tour, I noticed a walk to units on the north side is quite long, on uncarpetd, unforgiving concrete. The kitchens and bathrooms are “blank slates” for owners to finish the way they want, but the cost of the units do not reflect this.
    The neighborhood just east of downtown is “urban safe”, but not “suburban safe”. Houses go for a lot less, but do need a lot of work. It depends on what you want.
    I’m a Peak (R.I.P. CapFit) member, and a walk is about 20 minutes, a bike ride is 5-10, depending on how I catch the lights. I have only seen two or three other bikes locked up when I did; it is hard to tell if anyone walked there vs. walked from a car parked around the corner, so I don’t know that number.
    Glenwood South will soon need another public deck, in addition to 510 and Powerhouse Square. The Quorum building looks to have excess capacity, especially at night, but will people walk a few blocks?

  • bill

    I don’t live in the Hudson but I’ve toured the building and have visited people there and I think it’s the best value in downtown. You couldn’t have imagined F-street being as nice as it is when they started construction on the Hudson and that area will be completely different again in another year. Tenants upfit the kitchens and bathrooms to their tastes and the price per sqf still winds up being a great price. The heavy duty steel frame construction is rivaled only by the Quorum, which is a really exceptional and expensive building. The stick construction and synthetic stucco of other condo projects kinda suck. And one parking lot per unit is probably one more space than will be provided by some of the upcoming projects. Will the Nash really have more than 200 parking spaces?
    I have no vested interest in the Hudson, I just think it deserves more praise than it’s receiving here.

  • bill

    I don’t live in the Hudson but I’ve toured the building and have visited people there and I think it’s the best value in downtown. You couldn’t have imagined F-street being as nice as it is when they started construction on the Hudson and that area will be completely different again in another year. Tenants upfit the kitchens and bathrooms to their tastes and the price per sqf still winds up being a great price. The heavy duty steel frame construction is rivaled only by the Quorum, which is a really exceptional and expensive building. The stick construction and synthetic stucco of other condo projects kinda suck. And one parking lot per unit is probably one more space than will be provided by some of the upcoming projects. Will the Nash really have more than 200 parking spaces?
    I have no vested interest in the Hudson, I just think it deserves more praise than it’s receiving here.

  • James

    An earlier poster used the fact that “Developers and builders don’t just build a home and hope it sells. They research market prices, absorbtion of inventory and speculate where the market is trending.” as justification that the Raleigh market is not over-valued.
    Is he also not aware that developers (or the LLCs they create) go bankrupt in droves? The argument is akin to an investor in the stock market saying “That stock price will never go down. Brokers do a lot of research on p/e, fundamentals etc. They don’t just randomly pick a stock and buy.” Ahh, if only it were that easy. Talk to anybody who invested in the east coast condo market in the late 80s and early 90s. Now I have no idea if Raleigh is over-valued, but please don’t take the fact that a developer sees value to prove that there is value.

  • James

    An earlier poster used the fact that “Developers and builders don’t just build a home and hope it sells. They research market prices, absorbtion of inventory and speculate where the market is trending.” as justification that the Raleigh market is not over-valued.
    Is he also not aware that developers (or the LLCs they create) go bankrupt in droves? The argument is akin to an investor in the stock market saying “That stock price will never go down. Brokers do a lot of research on p/e, fundamentals etc. They don’t just randomly pick a stock and buy.” Ahh, if only it were that easy. Talk to anybody who invested in the east coast condo market in the late 80s and early 90s. Now I have no idea if Raleigh is over-valued, but please don’t take the fact that a developer sees value to prove that there is value.

  • http://www.raleighmsa.com/ Ernest Pecounis

    Maybe I speak for a small group of people, but with the exception of Marriott Hotel – too small and too uninspiring – everything so far has exceeded my expectations. For example, Fayetteville Street looks better than I thought it would. RBC Plaza is taller than I expected, although I am a bit confused why the developer doesn’t add residential floors if there is so much demand. In addition, there are already 2-3 good residential projects proposed for the North End (Seabord Warehouses). All that on the top of so many other neat projects. We are not there yet, but perceptions will change in the next 2 years.
    I do understand lee’s concerns, and while I do not see DT Raleigh the same way he does, I think there is one area that we need improvement, ASAP: Infills. Whether residential, commercial or mixed-use, we need to create continuous flow of traffic, both pedestrian and vehicular. Walking from Park Deveraux to Glenwood South is not much of a walk, but what is in between lacks in terms of interest.

  • http://www.raleighmsa.com Ernest Pecounis

    Maybe I speak for a small group of people, but with the exception of Marriott Hotel – too small and too uninspiring – everything so far has exceeded my expectations. For example, Fayetteville Street looks better than I thought it would. RBC Plaza is taller than I expected, although I am a bit confused why the developer doesn’t add residential floors if there is so much demand. In addition, there are already 2-3 good residential projects proposed for the North End (Seabord Warehouses). All that on the top of so many other neat projects. We are not there yet, but perceptions will change in the next 2 years.
    I do understand lee’s concerns, and while I do not see DT Raleigh the same way he does, I think there is one area that we need improvement, ASAP: Infills. Whether residential, commercial or mixed-use, we need to create continuous flow of traffic, both pedestrian and vehicular. Walking from Park Deveraux to Glenwood South is not much of a walk, but what is in between lacks in terms of interest.

  • dbearhug

    I was wondering when that corner was going to get finished, so it’s good to see it being filled in. I’m just curious as to how the parking is going to be in the evenings at Legends and CC’s. My guess is that it will probably move to the west side of the complex, especially since Jillians tanked. That’s progress for you.

  • dbearhug

    I was wondering when that corner was going to get finished, so it’s good to see it being filled in. I’m just curious as to how the parking is going to be in the evenings at Legends and CC’s. My guess is that it will probably move to the west side of the complex, especially since Jillians tanked. That’s progress for you.

  • JRD

    I just think that the thing should be taller in order to distinguish itself from the other condos in DT. It especially needs to be taller because it is a prime spot for a tall building that will help fill in “the gap”, or at least the gap that will be once the new Reynolds building goes up. That area is the next up and coming part of downtown, and to see something so short and stubby going up in such an opportune place is disappointing to say the least. Plus it seems to me that condos that are higher up and have good views sell better anyways. And its UGLY!!! Am I the only one that sees this?

  • JRD

    I just think that the thing should be taller in order to distinguish itself from the other condos in DT. It especially needs to be taller because it is a prime spot for a tall building that will help fill in “the gap”, or at least the gap that will be once the new Reynolds building goes up. That area is the next up and coming part of downtown, and to see something so short and stubby going up in such an opportune place is disappointing to say the least. Plus it seems to me that condos that are higher up and have good views sell better anyways. And its UGLY!!! Am I the only one that sees this?